One problem solved

1959kombi · Force Sensitive Joined: 14 Jun 2008 Posts: 17

Think this might be the reason of my noisy fuel pump, its like sand.

ElusiveStranger · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:56 am Post subject:

5hit like that in a post pump filter isn't good!
Since replacing my tank I have a load of crap go into my pump. Done 2 wash outs since.

Does anyone know where you can buy a 12mm O/D fiilter to go pre-pump?
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ruby bay · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:46 am Post subject:

here you go, available in most sizes chaps, not mine and not used this guy bhttp://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SYTEC-BULLET-FUEL-FILTER-CARB-INJECTION-PRE-OR-MAIN_W0QQitemZ310063860075QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item48313f096b&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12%7C66%3A2%7C39%3A1%7C72%3A1689%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50ut price seems reasonable to me.

ruby bay · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:48 am Post subject:

oops, wrong link....here you go...again!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FUEL-INJECTION-PUMP-FILTER-CATERHAM-7-WESTFIELD-DAX_W0QQitemZ120450603072QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item1c0b6a5840&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12%7C66%3A2%7C39%3A1%7C72%3A1689%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

rjes · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:45 pm Post subject:

All the Bosch pumps and their clones have a fliter very much like a really fine tea strainer inside then, the full diameter of the filter, between the inlet and the pump internals. If all that crap originated in the tank, the filter in your pump must have failed. There are some extremely tight tolerances inside the pump, so that lot going through probably won't have done it any good. A lot of the finely toleranced parts are ceramic though, I imagine because it wears better than steel.

Be very vary of pre pump filters. The Bosch style external pumps are not intended to have a fitler in the suction side, just the in tank strainer and the one inside the filter. An additional filter is definoitely capable of restricting the flow enough for the pump to cavitate. I've had customers have it happen. This is why they always have the filter after the pump in OEM installations.
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Richard,

R J Engineered Solutions
Quality Subaru Powered VW Components
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ruby bay · Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 6:19 pm Post subject:

so you are dammed if you do and dammed if you dont! no wonder you dont see any old scoobies on the road.

1959kombi · Force Sensitive Joined: 14 Jun 2008 Posts: 17

I run this filter as a pre-filter to my Walbro pump. Seems ok so far, well except when the fliter gets clogged up, but I've only done 60 miles or so, some other problem might surface with more miles.

Jon

ElusiveStranger · Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:40 am Post subject:

rjes · Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:16 pm Post subject:

I'm not sure what the 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' comment above is supposed to mean. There is a suction strainer inside all VW tanks, and also one in all Bosch style rotary pumps (and almost certainly Walbro and all the others too, but I've never taken than apart or seen drawings of their internals). That was sufficient to keep reasonable amounts of tank debris from causing problems for the pump in all the OEM uses of this style of external pump .

See http://www.vwkd.co.uk/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2570 for what happens in a 2wd T25 when there is an unreasonable amount of crap in the tank. If you have that much crap in the tank, the in tank strainer gets blocked by all the debris and causes pump cavitation - i.e. noise and accelerated pump wear. Either clean it out or replace the tank.

The Bosch type pump I dismantled was returned by a customer because it kept blowing fuses because it wouldn't rotate. As he'd also managed to put some rather large dents in it, I couldn't send it back, so I took it to bits to investigate myself. Everything looked fine apart from a tear in the suction strainer inside. My theory is that this had let through a tiny pieces of debris, and jammed the rotor, as everything moved freely once it was apart.

It's beyond me why anyone would re-use a 2nd hand fuel filter, especially since a customer managed to fit his used Subaru filter backwards (despite the arrows), and flush all the crap the filter had collected over many years of use in a Subaru in to his fuel rails. What are the chances of it being remotely new on a 10+ year old Subaru? Not very big.

I'm in the middle of putting together a fuel system kit, complete with everything needed. The main driver for this is to make it as easy as possible to install an engine conversion. However, with the amount of people who do daft things with fuel system components, such as:

* putting the pump in unsuitable locations which increase the chances of cavitation (such as a long way from and / or above the tank)
* using unsuitable hose types
* unsuitable rubber mounts which transmit excess noise into the body

.......and the amount of support time this takes helping them sort the problems out, I'm considering stopping selling the individual parts once the kit is finished. I think I'll add reusing 2nd hand filters to the list.
_________________
Regards,

Richard,

R J Engineered Solutions
Quality Subaru Powered VW Components
www.rjes.com

ruby bay · Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:46 pm Post subject:

no offence like, but i cant imagine running a car without a pre pump filter, thats all i meant. even if the pumps got a filter in it after putting in a new engine/messing about with the old tank i would think there a lot of crud floating about, ready to be sucked up and then block the pump, post filter then injectors.

hansend23 · Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject:

ive been running a 78 fi style fuel pump.the last few dayz i did a scooby in tank pump... it runs so smooth now.big difference.
i welded a stainless cooking bowel to the bottem of my tank for a sump and made a baffel inside.bought a new scoobi pump,and installed that.
while i had huge holes in the tank i scrubbed it out real clean.
works very good

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ElusiveStranger · Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:49 pm Post subject: